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Terry Brown departs from AFCW?
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Simon
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hants Red wrote:
"How many times have you ever heard a legal case being brought, let alone a successful one. So in reality what you are saying is a load of hot air."

Brian is correct I'm affraid; if you do not do it this way you leave youself open. What AFCW have done is the correct way to approach the minefield of employment law.


So you are saying I have a case against Crawley Town then. After all I quite fancied the job but I never saw it advertised.

There isn't a hope in hell that a legal case would stand up which is why despite the majority of football vacancies not being advertised no-one has ever claimed in court they were wrongly passed over.
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Paulc222
Assistant Manager
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Joined: 09 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was captain of the school team when I was 10 (Jordans in Martyrs Avenue - no longer in existence). Would that qualify me for the Wimbledon job? I imagine they might turn me down for being over qualified. We let in a lot of goals so at least I could guarantee some continuity.
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Laguna Man
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2012 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex BH wrote:
Walker12 wrote:
Anyone who wants to apply for the job go for it Wink

http://www.afcwimbledon.co.uk/.....78227.aspx

Shows what a tinpot club they are, advertising it online, they are bound to be flooded with fake applications.


Be fair now, they've also put a card in every newsagent's window in Merton and Kingston.
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Ian
Director of Football
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Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Last Visit: 30 May 2017
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian the wateratt wrote:
Ian wrote:
brian the wateratt wrote:
Alex BH wrote:
Walker12 wrote:
Anyone who wants to apply for the job go for it Wink

http://www.afcwimbledon.co.uk/.....78227.aspx

Shows what a tinpot club they are, advertising it online, they are bound to be flooded with fake applications.

Probably means they already know who they are going to appoint and are just going through the motions to comply legally


And what do they have to do to comply legally then?

I assume we (and most other football clubs) broke the law when we didn't advertise our managers job on our website then? Or are you struggling a bit? Rolling Eyes

Ian


There is no specific legal requirement for employers to advertise every job vacancy that arises. However, the risk in recruiting friends, family or other contacts of current employees without advertising a vacancy externally is that this may give rise to allegations of unlawful discrimination.

Where the workforce is predominantly male or female, or comprised of, for example, a particular racial group, informal recruitment methods such as word-of-mouth or personal recommendation perpetuate the existing imbalance and restrict the choice of applicants.

This can constitute indirect discrimination against the sex or race that is under-represented in the workplace. As a result, applicants who do not hear about a vacancy until it is too late to apply for it because candidates have been sought through an informal recruitment exercise may be able to claim discrimination on the basis that the recruitment method was a discriminatory arrangement.


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Ian
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coach wrote:
Ian wrote:
I used to go to school with someone who, at the age of 15, collected rejection letters from professional Football Clubs by applying for every vacant managers job going! Laughing


John the Gas?? Cool


I WENT TO SCHOOL WITH!

Mate, I'm not 60! Laughing

Ian
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Darren
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

smackwizard wrote:
Walker12 wrote:
Anyone who wants to apply for the job go for it Wink

http://www.afcwimbledon.co.uk/.....78227.aspx


Think I'm in with a shot.

I've got a pretty decent record on 'Football Manager' Cool


http://soccerlens.com/from-pla.....ger/66668/ Wink
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nemo
Coach
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Simon wrote:
brian the wateratt wrote:
Ian wrote:
brian the wateratt wrote:
Alex BH wrote:
Walker12 wrote:
Anyone who wants to apply for the job go for it Wink

http://www.afcwimbledon.co.uk/.....78227.aspx

Shows what a tinpot club they are, advertising it online, they are bound to be flooded with fake applications.

Probably means they already know who they are going to appoint and are just going through the motions to comply legally


And what do they have to do to comply legally then?

I assume we (and most other football clubs) broke the law when we didn't advertise our managers job on our website then? Or are you struggling a bit? Rolling Eyes

Ian


However, the risk in recruiting friends, family or other contacts of current employees without advertising a vacancy externally is that this may give rise to allegations of unlawful discrimination.

Where the workforce is predominantly male or female, or comprised of, for example, a particular racial group, informal recruitment methods such as word-of-mouth or personal recommendation perpetuate the existing imbalance and restrict the choice of applicants.

This can constitute indirect discrimination against the sex or race that is under-represented in the workplace. As a result, applicants who do not hear about a vacancy until it is too late to apply for it because candidates have been sought through an informal recruitment exercise may be able to claim discrimination on the basis that the recruitment method was a discriminatory arrangement.


Most director level roles in large companies are filled by headhunters and not by advert, as are most management jobs in football. The reason is not discriminatory, but because we are talking about very specific skills, experience and record.

How many times have you ever heard a legal case being brought, let alone a successful one. So in reality what you are saying is a load of hot air.


Employment practices is an area that has come into sharp focus in recent years. Some recent examples of the types of thing that can arise:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19668420
http://www.abc.net.au/news/201.....section=sa

If you think that a prospective manager who feels particularly aggrieved that they have been overlooked for a job will never bring a case then I would suggest you are being highly complacent.

There has been a publicity recently about the lack of black and ethnic managers in the game compared to the numbers playing - witness the Clark Carlisle prog from a month or two back.

With live in a society that is growing in its litigeous nature so its only prudent to manage your exposures accordingly.
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coach
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian wrote:
coach wrote:
Ian wrote:
I used to go to school with someone who, at the age of 15, collected rejection letters from professional Football Clubs by applying for every vacant managers job going! Laughing


John the Gas?? Cool


I WENT TO SCHOOL WITH!

Mate, I'm not 60! Laughing

Ian


neither is he, but dont tell the guy on the turnstile Laughing
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weststandwatcher
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is getting a little silly.

The problems you can run into when employing someone start when you advertise a position. There is however, no legal requirement to advertise a post.

If anyone is in any doubt of this, please point me in the direction of the advertisements CTFC (or any football club for that matter) have placed for when they wish to recruit a new centre forward....or goalkeeper etc etc.
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Ian
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Location: The Parish of Rusper

PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

weststandwatcher wrote:
This is getting a little silly.

The problems you can run into when employing someone start when you advertise a position.


It's why people are reluctant to employ. Someone needs to tell the Government. The claptrap that Brian is coming out with is holding the country back. With the number of sole traders in this country, if each of them employed someone unemployment would be virtually wiped out, but they have to jump through so many hoops, they just don't bother.

The fault is spread across the whole political spectrum, no party politics on this issue.

Ian
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nemo
Coach
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian wrote:
weststandwatcher wrote:
This is getting a little silly.

The problems you can run into when employing someone start when you advertise a position.


It's why people are reluctant to employ. Someone needs to tell the Government. The claptrap that Brian is coming out with is holding the country back. With the number of sole traders in this country, if each of them employed someone unemployment would be virtually wiped out, but they have to jump through so many hoops, they just don't bother.

The fault is spread across the whole political spectrum, no party politics on this issue.

Ian

Dont shoot the messenger Rolling Eyes
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Ian
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

brian the wateratt wrote:
Dont shoot the messenger Rolling Eyes


I get the feeling that you are an enthusiastic messenger who backs the message.

Am I wrong?

Ian
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nemo
Coach
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian wrote:
brian the wateratt wrote:
Dont shoot the messenger Rolling Eyes


I get the feeling that you are an enthusiastic messenger who backs the message.

Am I wrong?

Ian

I'm a risk consultant as such I would look to flag a potential risk where it exists - I don't create the exposure I just seek to highlight it and recommend a course of action so to reiterate, don't shoot the messenger
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mustaphashot
Assistant Manager
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Joined: 06 Mar 2007
Last Visit: 25 May 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will be safe if it is Big John Akinde that does the shooting.
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